Just finished the fisk...learned a lot more about Moore than I wanted to. Ironically the tone of that interview reminds me of that fawning puff-piece that far left journo character did on Ozymandias in Watchmen.
If Moore had just written "Watchmen" and "V for Vendetta" and never touched DC's legacy characters, that would be one thing. But "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow" is a pretty bleak deconstruction of Superman once you get past the bright Silver Age-style artwork, and "For the Man Who Has Everything" wasn't much better. As for Batman, "The Killing Joke" probably did more than any other work to push the idea that Batman's no different from the thieves and murderers he fights. I used to think grimdark comics were bad imitations of Moore's style, but I was wrong - they're actually pretty good imitations.
“For the Man who has Everything” was still the basis for a pretty good Justice League Unlimited animated episode, underlining both Superman’s and Batman’s integrity in rejecting their perfect fantasy worlds for the painful real one and their responsibilities there. And I give “Killing Joke” props for rejecting the Joker’s excuses with a definitive “No, you might’ve had a bad day, but you still chose this.” Not going to defend Moore as a person, or what his imitators did, but when I see good work I see good work.
You know, *if* his observation about a 'desire for simpler times'-- meaning, people reject everything they like or ever liked being turned into pr0n-- the observation that it comes before "fascism" might even be true, because the various socialist/communist/totalitarian governments keep trying to destroy all competing thigns-- which is absolutely anything else that people value-- and when people object, those nuts double down.
In the definition of "fascism" which is "any time s/c/t fails."
About a quarter of the way through. I can’t say I’m a big fan of Moore these days, but I thought thought Watchmen was pretty good and I enjoyed his take on Swamp Thing and a few of his Superman stories, although I think the comics industry as a whole suffered from every other story trying to be the new Watchmen. And to give a fisk of a fisk - “And I may I say on behalf of all those who are not his fans: ‘Thank God!’” - my first reaction is: why do you care? If you’re not his fans, just don’t read him. But I admit I’m being disingenuous. Like I said, he’s had an undue influence on the comics industry. But again, if that’s the case then what good does it do for him to drop out of comics now? The damage has been done.
Took a look at the Watchmen critique. I can’t say I agree: I’d argue the characters may have all compromised with evil for a ‘greater good’ - or more specifically they compromised with a lesser evil to avert the greater one of nuclear Armageddon - but Moore and the story itself doesn’t say this was the unambiguously correct thing to do, as evidenced by all the sympathy given to Rorsarch. And there’s no indication that evil has been defeated and Ozimandes’ utopian scheme will last. The finding of his journal makes that very point. It doesn’t undercut the story’s message, it undercut’s Ozymandies’ hubris.
Just finished the fisk...learned a lot more about Moore than I wanted to. Ironically the tone of that interview reminds me of that fawning puff-piece that far left journo character did on Ozymandias in Watchmen.
If Moore had just written "Watchmen" and "V for Vendetta" and never touched DC's legacy characters, that would be one thing. But "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow" is a pretty bleak deconstruction of Superman once you get past the bright Silver Age-style artwork, and "For the Man Who Has Everything" wasn't much better. As for Batman, "The Killing Joke" probably did more than any other work to push the idea that Batman's no different from the thieves and murderers he fights. I used to think grimdark comics were bad imitations of Moore's style, but I was wrong - they're actually pretty good imitations.
“For the Man who has Everything” was still the basis for a pretty good Justice League Unlimited animated episode, underlining both Superman’s and Batman’s integrity in rejecting their perfect fantasy worlds for the painful real one and their responsibilities there. And I give “Killing Joke” props for rejecting the Joker’s excuses with a definitive “No, you might’ve had a bad day, but you still chose this.” Not going to defend Moore as a person, or what his imitators did, but when I see good work I see good work.
You know, *if* his observation about a 'desire for simpler times'-- meaning, people reject everything they like or ever liked being turned into pr0n-- the observation that it comes before "fascism" might even be true, because the various socialist/communist/totalitarian governments keep trying to destroy all competing thigns-- which is absolutely anything else that people value-- and when people object, those nuts double down.
In the definition of "fascism" which is "any time s/c/t fails."
About a quarter of the way through. I can’t say I’m a big fan of Moore these days, but I thought thought Watchmen was pretty good and I enjoyed his take on Swamp Thing and a few of his Superman stories, although I think the comics industry as a whole suffered from every other story trying to be the new Watchmen. And to give a fisk of a fisk - “And I may I say on behalf of all those who are not his fans: ‘Thank God!’” - my first reaction is: why do you care? If you’re not his fans, just don’t read him. But I admit I’m being disingenuous. Like I said, he’s had an undue influence on the comics industry. But again, if that’s the case then what good does it do for him to drop out of comics now? The damage has been done.
But I’m feeling a bit silly defending Moore when he’d probably have me put against a wall for the firing squad these days.
Took a look at the Watchmen critique. I can’t say I agree: I’d argue the characters may have all compromised with evil for a ‘greater good’ - or more specifically they compromised with a lesser evil to avert the greater one of nuclear Armageddon - but Moore and the story itself doesn’t say this was the unambiguously correct thing to do, as evidenced by all the sympathy given to Rorsarch. And there’s no indication that evil has been defeated and Ozimandes’ utopian scheme will last. The finding of his journal makes that very point. It doesn’t undercut the story’s message, it undercut’s Ozymandies’ hubris.